Monday update « Brooks Hatch

category: Brooks' Musings

Monday update 152CommentsMonday+update2008-02-25+21%3A38%3A36Brooks+Hatch

To anyone advocating former WSU/Oklahoma/Indiana coach Kelvin Sampson as the answer to OSU’s men’s basketball woes:

Indiana men’s basketball had a perfect record with the NCAA until Sampson arrived there. No major violations. Now it faces five possibly ”major” violations, primarily related to telephone-recruiting restrictions put on Sampson and his staff for his violations at Oklahoma.

The NCAA contends Sampson repeatedly lied about subsequent violations with the Hoosiers to Indiana and NCAA investigators.

The NCAA’s Committee on Infractions is expected to hear the case on June 14 (long after OSU will have made its hire).

It’s also possible Sampson could receive a ”show-cause” order, which would effectively stop him from coaching at a different NCAA school for the duration of the order.

Kelvin Sampson might be a nice guy (a former co-worker was his neighbor in Pullman, mowed his lawn, and really like him). But he’s been “convicted” of cheating once, and probably will again, for more than 650 against-the-rules phone calls to recruits.

He’s not the guy OSU wants representing it. And what happens in Berkeley over the next month will have far more impact on the OSU job than Kelvin Sampson ever will.

————————————————————————–

And two tips o’ the blog’s hat to:

* The staffs and players of the Crescent Valley and Corvallis baseball programs, for their assistance during the Corvallis Little League’s baseball and softball clinics this past weekend. My son had a great time, and learned a lot.

* To Eugene Register-Guard sports reporter Adam Jude and his wife, Ashley, who are expecting their first child later this year. A season covering the OSU men’s basketball program is great preparation for the first six months of infancy.

Tweet This Post

subscribe to comments RSS

152CommentsMonday+update2008-02-25+21%3A38%3A36Brooks+Hatch

CV3000 says:

February 25, 2008 at 3:07 pm

Dick Vitale says: Dipsy doo pre-paid phone-aroo, baby! He’d be an orange and black dandy, baby!

How hard could it be to just pu a v-chip on his phone or something?

With his buyout money (350k less than JJ’s) taken into account, that’s the best coach available for the additional 700-800k that it would take to put him on the Orange Express.

Reply
admin says:

February 25, 2008 at 4:10 pm

Uh, there’s a very good chance the NCAA might ban Kelvin Sampson from coaching at any NCAA level. That includes OSU, of course. NOBODY in college is going to hire him until he gets a full, clean bill of health from the NCAA (which Dennis Erickson had, lest anyone bring up the apples-to-oranges comparisons between DE and KS).

His next job will be in the NBA.

Sampson took a lump-sum payment. OSU is still playing Jay John on a monthly basis through 2009-10, so chances are JJ will eventually receive far, far less from OSU than the full $1.1 million he’s currently owed.

Any salary at his new job (I’m hearing rumors of some kind of NBA position, with a Northwest Division team, not the Blazers; i fnot, he’ll be coaching someplace next season, because that’s what he does) will be subtracted from what the Beavers owe him. If he leaves his next job for another, OSU’s contractual obligations cease altogether.

Reply
Tim Sullivan says:

February 25, 2008 at 4:26 pm

Kelvin needs to step back a bit. I like the guy, but he’s in a spiral that he needs to get out of. I can see how one gets to that point, though many don’t do cheat: Here’s X amount of dollars if you win, here’s X amount of fame, accolades, the Hall of Fame waiting (one of the youngest guys to 500 wins or something like that) and he chased those things like no tomorrow. I’m not advocating it, but I can see how Kelvin got caught up in that. What I don’t get is IU hired him on the contingency that he NOT do that and he did it. Also, an assistant got thrown under the bus.

I really think Kelvin needs to step back from coaching altogether for a year, be it college or pro. He needs to re-assess who he is and how he got there. I know Kelvin, he’s a good guy and I honestly do think he’s better at a school like OSU, where he can grind-it-out. But hiring fresh off these allegations probably wouldn’t look too good for OSU.

Then again, DeCarolis seems to be the master of looking bad of late. That mid-season firing of Jay John was idiotic, pointless, senseless, and heartless.

Reply
Disagree, Tim says:

February 25, 2008 at 5:20 pm

The mid-season firing of Jay John was an act of mercy. It wasn’t so much about winning the remainder of the games this year, but putting a coach and fan base out of his and our misery.

Reply
Tim Sullivan says:

February 25, 2008 at 5:25 pm

It only put OSU fans in more misery with a coach who is by far worse than Jay John. Bad move, horrible PR blunder by DeCarolis. Is the fan base out of its misery yet, or are they enjoying trailing 40-9 in games? I guarantee John wouldn’t have a team that trailed 40-9.

As a Pac-10 friend of mine (not a Beav, Coug, nor Duck) said, “One of the most classless moves he’s ever seen in college athletics.”

I totally agree. I’d like to believe OSU as an institution is beyond doing things like that. I have no respect for the A.D., and I don’t care how much money he raises. Jay John carried himself with class and deserved better. DeCarolis and the fans crying for a mid-season change are getting exactly what they deserve.

Does the hot-head A.D. still scream at his employees in public or has he corrected that awful character flaw?

Reply
Matt says:

February 25, 2008 at 6:32 pm

I was going to ask if all of the “Fire Jay John Now” bandleaders would like to step up and defend their positions… after the fact. They were the ones who so clearly saw via hindsight that Bob DeCarolis had made a horrific mistake by extending the coach’s contract.

“Disagree, Tim” stated correctly that the firing of John was “an act of mercy”. Why was it an act of mercy? Because all the FJJN idiots were making so much noise that no one could stand it. I finally relented and hoped John would be fired because the clamoring was so loud.

You got what you wanted – JJ’s gone.

You got what you deserved – “Oh and soon-to-be-18, baby!”

Stand up and own your mistakes, oh wise members of the “Fire Jay John Now” club! You thought it couldn’t get any worse and HEY… you were WRONG!

Enjoy it.

Reply
Ben says:

February 25, 2008 at 7:50 pm

What are the chances the next Osu coach comes from the Pac-10 ranks, either Ben Braun is could be gone at Cal and Ernie Kent who is as good as gone at Oregon if they dont make the NCAA tourney

Reply
jay vinson says:

February 25, 2008 at 8:21 pm

Please, please, please – no duck leftovers at OSU

Reply
Tim Sullivan says:

February 25, 2008 at 8:44 pm

I don’t think Braun or Kent is the answer for OSU. Neither are horrible coaches, but I think OSU could do better. Contrary to popular belief, I agree with the admin here: It will be the best job on the West Coast this year. Why? It’s the Pac-10. WCC gyms top out at 6K, Pac-10 gyms average over 10K. And yes, I think Randy Bennett would be a better hire than Kent or Braun … I’m thinking one of those two keeps their jobs, however.

Regarding my ongoing opinion on how DeCarolis handled this mess: I believe he should be held accountable for this. He makes a healthy six figures of state taxpayer money and should have to own up to his mistakes, just like Killwrestling in Eugene should explain how he plead poverty in killing a sport when six days later he accepted a donation of $100 million, and then two months later accepted a $64 million donation from IMG marketing last week. That’s $164 million in three months and he plead poverty. Why isn’t he being held accountable? People afraid of making the big bad boozer boy A.D. angry? Sheesh.

Reply
beaver pride says:

February 25, 2008 at 9:23 pm

Tim, JJ’s team was down 25-0 to Hawaii Hilo! Get a clue.

Reply
Tim Sullivan says:

February 25, 2008 at 10:32 pm

I do have a clue: Jay John is better than Mouton. Number two, they didn’t play Hawaii-Hilo, they played Hawaii of the WAC and that was last year. Hilo is a D2 school. I wouldn’t say get a clue to anyone when you don’t have one.

Number three, the only wins this year were under coach Jay John. Coach Mouton has not delivered any victories.

Don’t stick up for that move, have some courage and be yourself, not DeCarolis’ puppet.

Reply
admin says:

February 25, 2008 at 10:49 pm

Cleaning up the debris here:

As far as accountability goes, I don’t think BDC made the decision to change coaches in midseason without the support and OK of his boss.

And while the change has not resulted in any wins, I think it was widely viewed as the right move by the players; by the vast majority of the fan base that still shows up to games, and the many fans who have abandoned the program physically but still follow it closely and are ready to return if given a good reason to com eback.

OSU was trailing badly to Hawaii last season, not Hilo.

And (IMHO) the mid-season decision to change coaches gave everybody a breather, several months to realize that a change was forthcoming and that (perhaps) better things are in store.

At the time of the change, the season was going nowhere anyways, and the AD needed to regain some credibility with the remaining suporters of the MBB program, and the thousands who had already jumped ship.

BTW, St. Mary’s defeated San DIego tonight in Moraga and is now 24-4 heading into Saturday’s WCC showdown with Gonzaga in Spokane.

I’m probably wrong. But IMHO, that guy is still the No. 1 candidate as the next OSU men’s basketball coach. And from everything I have heard or read, I believe he’s a better choice than virtually all of the names I’ve heard floated, including the latest supposed top candidate. Mr. Steve Alford of the University of New Mexico.

As far as Ernie Kent goes: 1. He still has a job. 2. I’d expect his secretive former employer would suddenly be infected with a new spirit of full public disclosure should EK ever be hired by the Beavers.

Reply
Tim Sullivan says:

February 26, 2008 at 8:19 am

I’ll respectfully disagree with admin on the mid-season move, but note to others: That’s how you conduct public discourse. You don’t name call, you just put out the argument.

I’m in agreement with admin on Randy Bennett. He is outstanding and a star on the rise. Nine out of the current 10 head coaches in the Pac-10 earned their stripes successfully at the mid-major level before being hired in the conference. Everyone I’ve talked to, including people in the hoops biz, say Randy Bennett is very good.

His energy and enthusiasm, combined with his West Coast and Australia recruiting prowess, would be just what the Beavs would need, IMO. Will Randy Bennett get hired? I don’t know. But I do know he’s an outstanding coach.

Reply
Eric #1 says:

February 26, 2008 at 9:46 am

Tim, OSU’s season was going nowhere. They would have finished 0-18 under JJ just as they will Mouton. Are you aware they lost to Alaska Fairbanks?

Firing JJ was not classless; it was the right move. It sucks to fire anyone but when someone doesn’t do their job they must be fired for the sake of everyone else. Removing JJ from the equation mid-season puts OSU light years ahead of where they would be in the coaching search process at season’s end. And it’s also worth mentioning that OSU is honoring its contract with JJ and still pays his salary.

Reply
Jay Vinson says:

February 26, 2008 at 10:29 am

Tim … Regarding name-calling, you might want to review your own postings. Your obvious dislike of Bob DeCarolis colors nad diminishes the effect of everything you write.

Reply
Tim Sullivan says:

February 26, 2008 at 10:35 am

I don’t dislike Bob DeCarolis, I don’t know him. I disrespect him, there’s a difference. Plus Jay, DeCarolis doesn’t care if you’re dead or alive, why defend him? He’s a business man paid by state tax funds. He wants your money, that’s all. If you quit supporting the Beavs, he wouldn’t care — that is unless you’re a five- to six-figure donor.

I respectfully disagree with Eric No. 1. I’ve seen a lot of bad coaches in the Pac-10, only two were fired at mid-season, and they were replaced by Todd Bozeman and Kevin Mouton.

Reply
Will Bullock says:

February 26, 2008 at 10:38 am

I like the sounds of Bennett, but he is becoming such a hot commodity right now that I wonder if he might get other high major offers that would be less of a re-building project than OSU. If Steve Alford were interested in the job, that would be awesome, but I would say the odds of that would be about as good as Bobby Knight being interested. I would put that at about 500-1 instead of 5-1 (where does Canzano get this stuff — he is making it up, right?)

One name that I have not seen mentioned much is Thomason from Pacific. He was a finalist back when Jay John got the job and has had a pretty good run down there. Is he too old?

Reply
Konce says:

February 26, 2008 at 10:42 am

Tim,

I don’t agree with the timing of the move either. It should have come at the end of last year! That’s when the most clamor for a new coach began. It only got louder and louder because nothing was done (certainly it was perceived that way) and people began wondering how bad it had to get before something would be done. Thus, as Brooks so aptly suggests, “And (IMHO) the mid-season decision to change coaches gave everybody a breather, several months to realize that a change was forthcoming and that (perhaps) better things are in store.” Absolutely, that’s what it did!

Let’s go back to the end of last year. The Beavers were putting the finishing touches on a 3-16 conference season (that winning percentage, by the way comes out to .158…which, by the way, is exactly .001 better than the 34-183 conference record of the Beaver Football team during their 28 year losing-season streak). At that time, BDC said something along the lines of being happy with the coaching staff and the direction they were heading…and that they were “working hard”. Gave me lots of hope, I tell ya. Then when he later stated that if there weren’t improvement this year, there would be a change…well that didn’t mean much to me either…after all, a 4-15 conference mark would be an improvement. Thus, making a move in mid-season actually put some meat in his words. Again, I think it was half a season too late, but nevertheless, Jay John was fully aware that if his program didn’t show improvement over an abysmal season last year (I know, setting that bar awfully high) he would be shown the door. It’s usually standard practice to wait until the season is over…but Bob never promised the end of the season to John, and, I suspect BDC never thought the program would get as low as it has this season.

Another thing, I don’t know a single blessed person who thought that by firing John mid-season would get the Beavers a single victory this year. Nobody once ever said seriously that the interim coach would be an inherently better coach than John. Shouldn’t the term “interim” tell us something? And wasn’t he from Jay’s own staff?

In all fairness to that interim coach, Mouton, comparing his overall record with John’s is skewed, as I shall lay out forthwith. Jay John was the coach for the Beaver’s only wins, you’re correct, but it’s an insult to our intelligence for you to imply that the competition has been equal. It’s far better to compare conference marks. John is 0-6, Mouton is 0-9…that, my friend works out to exactly the same winning percentage. Give Mouton the same non-conference schedule and I think he comes out okay. Losing to Alaska Fairbanks, to TN Tech by 17 at home, and MT State (at home) is something I think he could at least equal…and, I think by the way, have a pretty fair shot at winning. In fact, let Mouton coach those games after 1/2 a season as the head coach and I’ll bet he wins at least 2 of ‘em (something John couldn’t do after 5+ seasons). But that’s beside the point.

Your constant railing on BDC for the timing of the firing is getting old, as you can tell. It’s kinda funny, it sounds much like the people railing on JJ before he was relieved of his duties. We all know how you feel about BDC, now it’s time for you to tell us how you feel about the AD at LSU that fired his head basketball coach a couple of weeks ago (and only a couple of years removed from that same coach taking LSU to the final four.)

Finally, Jay John had 5+ years to put his stamp on the program, your trying to drum up sympathy for him is an awfully hard sell.

Tim, I agree with you and Brooks on Randy Bennett. Names like Knight, Snyder, Sampson, and Alford are getting really old.

I maintain that if you’re not going to hire someone better than your old coach…don’t fire him in the first place.

By the way, there are some things I think we should all respect here, and that is the reality that we do are not privy to all the information that the brass at OSU has. Maybe BDC didn’t fire John after last season for monetary or other reasons and he’s playing his hand the best he can considering, I don’t know. I’ll just say this, I think OSU is a lot better off having BDC as the AD instead of me. (Even though I don’t always agree with him.) Also, Jay John is a much better basketball coach than I could ever dream of being and I wish the best to him, Mouton, and the other assistants wherever the future leads them.

Let’s give BDC a chance on this one (his first head coaching hire for men’s basketball, by the way) and see how it plays out a couple of years from now. No?

~Konce

Reply
Tim Sullivan says:

February 26, 2008 at 11:01 am

Very good post Konce. I’ll always be of the belief that unless a coach cheats or embarrasses the university off the floor or field, they should be able to finish it out. That’s just me, but I understand your argument. Mouton’s inability to get his team to do one thing well is frightening. He’s really lost them, and perhaps they were lost before he got them. I did think Jay John should’ve been fired at the end of the season.

I still think the A.D. should be held accountable for that crazy contract extension as well as replacing John with a coach, who simply can’t X and O or do one thing well. It’s mind-boggling how poorly coached they are … and I thought Paul Graham was bad.

I’m always puzzled as to why coaches get constant heat and A.D.’s always get free passes, from Killwrestling to Barbara Hedges (who didn’t get heat until real late in her tenure), to DeCarolis, to a WSU A.D. now at Arizona who put his department on probation TWICE and safely landed in Tucson. These guys are the epitome of the teflon men, yet they rake in the high state taxpayer salaries.

Nevertheless, someone new will be on board, and 99.9 percent of the basketball community knows Randy Bennett is a better coach than Steve Alford. Hopefully OSU is not in that .10 percent and hires the right guy, not the name guy.

Reply
Konce says:

February 26, 2008 at 11:26 am

Tim,

Good response. I agree.

~Konce

Reply
JuneauJim says:

February 26, 2008 at 11:59 am

Lots of good posts here gentleman. I was very much on the fire JJ bandwagon and had been since Cuic continued to get playing time even though he didn’t play hard or rebound. It has got to be disheartening to other players to see that go on with Cuic and then this year with CJ. Firing JJ midseason sends a message to fans and perhaps more importantly, the players. There is some good young talent on this team and it would be a shame to lose them because they were “homesick” like Montana Jack – who was the guy who seemed to play the hardest all the time last season.

Brooks, any rumblings about coaching names like Mark Fox from Nevada or Brad Stevens from Butler? Fox is finishing his fourth year after replacing Trent Johnson and has gone 98-28. Stevens or course is in his first year and would be a riskier choice.

Bennett seems like the hot guy right now, but he has been at it in Moraga for 7 plus years and is 126-97 which is a .565 winning percentage. Of course, he took over a program that won 2 games total in the year before his arrival. Fox and Stevens both inherited good programs.

Reply
mike says:

February 26, 2008 at 12:59 pm

Looking at these posts makes me much happier than driving and watching the team. The passion is back among the fans (now all we need is a coach and some players).

Reply
Kathleen says:

February 26, 2008 at 3:30 pm

I hear Bobby Knight has always loved the PNW… Wouldn’t that be something? Tickets would sell (if not to support our Beavers, then to boo BK) and it would certainly spark an interest.
I know this is a dumb thought, but I was overcome with stupidity.

Reply
Matt says:

February 26, 2008 at 6:01 pm

I love Bob Knight – partially because he’s a great coach and partially because he’s a media pariah.

Reply
admin says:

February 26, 2008 at 8:37 pm

Knight will not be OSU’s next coach.

And the worse a coach is in dealing with the media (and vice-versa), the more the fan loses because the less access we get, the less access you get by extension.

Reply
Andre says:

February 27, 2008 at 11:52 pm

Brooks, baby, I totally disagree. I know you have a job and all, and I’ll read the stories. But look at the coverage this year on the OSU men’s basketball team. Those poor kids and coaches got to get up after every game and think of something to say. And let’s be honest, there’s nothing they can say. The wheels came off the thing years ago. But will we let ‘em be? Who benefits? No us.

That said, I’d love to have Bobby Knight here. As a hoops junkie, I think it would be great. I think it would be bad for OSU, ultimately, he’s too out of date. But I’d dig it.

Reply